Setting The Table

Episode 9

Black Women in Activism and Food

Deb Freeman (00:05):

When you think about the civil rights movement, what comes to mind first? I would imagine that most people would talk about Dr. Martin Luther king, Jr. Maker Evers, Rosa parks, and the Louis rock nine. But there were countless others who supported the movement and some names we may never know, but there were some black women that supported the movement in a less obvious way. They weren't necessarily on television, but their culinary skills sustained people in the movement because you can't fight the power on an empty stomach. 

Welcome to Setting the Table, a podcast about black cuisine and food ways. I'm Deb Freeman. I'm a writer that focuses on African American food ways and the impact those food ways have on how we cook and eat today. Like most people I learned about the civil rights movement in school, but I had a unique educational experience. I went to an all Black Catholic school in the south, and one of our classes was black history. I'm grateful for that class because I was fortunate enough to learn about the achievements in history of black people year round. 

Although I took those classes for years, I never learned about people like Georgia Gilmore and the Club from Nowhere, Mildred Council or Aylene Quin, but they have stories that deserve to be talked about 

Deb Freeman (01:35):

On this episode, we're going to explore just a few of the stories of the relationship between Black women, food, and civil rights. And there's no better place to start than talking to my first guest author, Suzanne Cope. 

Suzanne Cope (01:50):

I'm a writer and professor. I'm the author of the book, Power Hungry, The Women Of The Black Panther Party And Freedom Summer And Their Fight To Feed A Movement. 

Deb Freeman (01:59):

I read her book earlier this year and I learned so much from it. I was curious to know more about her inspiration for writing it. 

Suzanne Cope (02:07):

I became activated like many people probably did around the same time, uh, about four or five years ago. And I was thinking about how to find stories of women who use food for political and social change in part for personal reasons. I just wanted to be inspired for myself. I wanted to be inspired to find out how to act and how people had done more than just fed people. Of course, I found that the answer was so much more complicated, right? Where, feeding people I knew was a very useful and transgressive act, but I discovered all the layers of how that could work to create political and social change. 

Deb Freeman (02:45):

What Suzanne uncovered while writing her book is the close relationship food has not only to civil rights, but human rights in general. 

Suzanne Cope (02:54):

Exactly. You know, what I mentioned earlier was thinking that at first I was like, there's gotta be that people did with food that wasn't just providing food, is kind of how I started looking for these stories. 

And of course, what I saw too, was a very necessary act that was happening at the time when I began some of this research such as people were protesting, so someone would order a bunch of pizzas and that is of course necessary. And also showing solidarity, you know, it works on multiple levels. 

But what I saw too is that first of all, how much the act of feeding people was undermined, tried to be stopped in so many ways. And for reasons that had to do with keeping power with the white supremacist power structure, it was unbelievable to think, wow, you would stop hungry people from eating, which is what the law enforcement did both during the voting rights fight. 

Suzanne Cope (03:44):

And also during the black Panther party free breakfast for children program, where they would actually confiscate food. That was meant for hungry people. 

One story that I came across was the Greenwood food blockade and the Mississippi Delta, where the white supremacist power structure at pretty much as retaliation for the voting rights organizing that was happening in the early 1960s. They stopped federal food aid during a very brutal winter. And that prompted so many people from the north and people of course, from around the area as well, to help feed people who were hungry. And it was just unbelievable. There was food to go around. Why is food something to be used as leverage? Why is food something that isn't a right? That isn't something that should just be given to people, especially when there is enough. 

And so that was very powerful to me. And it also went to show in the other direction, how, when you do feed people, when you show that people have a right to be fed and people understand that they are empowered, and you're also modeling a new power structure, they're modeling a different paradigm saying that people deserve to be fed. 

Suzanne Cope (04:50):

And it's not a matter of whether you have money or whether you are aligned with the political structure that's in power. And I thought, wow. Yeah, just by showing a different way of feeding people that really can show people a different way of moving in the world. And, and also once you have food, when you're, when you're not searching for something to eat, you have the energy, you have the space in your life to be able to do other things such as organize, such as protests, such as, you know, fight for the things that you think are important. And of course the government understood that, and that's so much why they were undermining all of these groups that were trying to feed people who are hungry. 

Deb Freeman (05:29):

Suzanne's book focuses on the stories of two women in particular. And one of them is Aylene Quin or Mama Quin that she's better known. Quin is a single mother of four and restaurant owner from the small Mississippi town of McComb. Like many of her contemporaries, her restaurant became a safe space for the local civil rights movement. 

Suzanne Cope (05:53):

Well, you have a place like Aylene Quin, south of the border. That was a community center. This was a place where people could see each other, could gather. And especially when they were under the scrutiny of government surveillance, this was a place where they could be out in the open and be connected to each other without arousing suspicion. And so it was important in that respect. It was important as a way for people to have the space to organize. A place where they could be together sometimes in the back room talking quietly to each other, which I thought was really amazing, but it was also a way that people like Aylene could have financial power where she wasn't beholden to another boss. She could be her own boss. And that was so important because I guess I didn't realize the extent of economic sanctions that were happening during this time where landlords would kick people out because they didn't like that they were trying to register to vote.

Suzanne Cope (06:46)

And people couldn't get a loan to buy their own home or alone to start their own business, unless that you were playing by the rules of the white supremacist power structure. All of these ways were seeking to keep black Americans from achieving any sort of economic power. And so you had someone like Aylene who owned her own business, who owned her own home. And she didn't really have to play by these rules. She could kind of do, you know, what she wanted in the community without fearing that her children wouldn't eat or that she would be kicked out of her house. 

And so that became very powerful and the ways too, that she could amass a middle class living and then help provide for other people as well. So she is passing this wealth along within her community. She opened up more businesses. She had a hair salon. She eventually opened a hotel. Those were of course serving the black community. But you know, she also was the safe haven and she was a boss. She provided jobs. She provided food. She provided security. 

Deb Freeman (07:49):

Aylene was considered to be such a threat that the local KKK even took notice. And on one hot September night in 19 64, 14 sticks of dynamite were thrown into her home. Fortunately, the family escaped with only minor injuries. And what did Mama Quin do? She went right back to work. One of my favorite stories of Aylene's exploits in Suzanne's book involves how she used her restaurant workers to feed civil rights activists who were in jail. 

Suzanne Cope (08:20):

It was these young people who were arrested, uh, in the wake of various movements. So you had some young people who had, uh, walked out of their high school in support of another young person who was one of the first people to, to try to integrate the local bus station. 

And so this large group of people, they all very peacefully marched to city hall in McComb. And they were met by an angry mob that beat some of them horribly that pulled that young 15 year old girl, Brenda Travis, who was the first to integrate the bus station, pulled her out of her shoes. It was horrific. And these were all teenagers, a few people in their young twenties. And they were thrown into jail with Robert Moses, who was a well known organizer at the time mom Quinn would come in or she'd send one of the people that she worked with. 

Suzanne Cope (09:12):

These elaborate feasts, one person who was in jail said he gained, you know, 15 pounds by eating these wonderful meals. And I remember writing that. I could just imagine that their dinner was better than the jailers, and they were allowed to come in and, and feed them. And it was of course, a show that, Hey, you have an entire community behind these people and Mama Quin, or some of the other women would stay and chat with them. 

And, and they were largely ignored because of course they were, people didn't think that women were effective leaders. They didn't think that women were really, you know, organizing at the time I came across that letter from Robert Moses, that just talks so eloquently about the power of this food. And they, they feel like they are just basically adrift and it's these women bringing this food, but also bringing the solidarity, allowing them to continue their work, letting them know that they are loved, showing love through food. 

Suzanne Cope (10:09):

I remember interviewing Curtis Hayes Muhammad, and he was just telling me that they just would wait all day for these meals to come in. And it was really what he said, sustained him during this time. He had just gotten out of jail for actually a sit-in at Woolworth's in McComb, which is not often written about, but he basically went in with someone else and was almost instantly arrested and beaten. And he had just gotten out and then he did another protest that, um, he ended up back in jail. He said that knowing that there were people on the outside who cared for them this much, really, really helped sustain him and made it all worthwhile. 

Deb Freeman (10:44):

I love this story so much. It speaks to the intelligence and social awareness necessary to navigate the world as a black woman, in order to get things done. Suzanne uses the term ‘activist mothering’ in her book, which I thought was incredibly accurate. And I asked her to elaborate more about it, 

Suzanne Cope (11:04):

Dr. Francoise Hamlin coined this term. And, but she was interestingly also looking at another activist mother like Mama Quin in Mississippi during this time period. And so the parallels and just this metaphor for activism through this feminist lens, I think is just so apt. 

And it's thinking about how you have a mother who is an activist, right? And she's doing these typical feminized mothering actions, but for so many other people. And it's also highlighting, I believe the femini skills that are so often underappreciated in leadership, think of the organizing that this requires how many people you need to have doing all these different tasks, having to negotiate your entry into a white run jail, having to organize this education that's happening on the outside, particularly in spaces where you are not taken seriously, as we obviously are discussing and where you don't have a lot of access. 

Suzanne Cope (12:00):

There's so many skills that Mama Quin was using. And of course that all of these women were using that just aren't thought of till today, even today, they're not thought of as being something that makes a great leader, but these women were leaders and their names. So rarely come up. When you're thinking about leaders in these movements. Cleo Silvers in the black Panther party, she has said absolutely thought of the work I was doing as a form of mothering. She said, even though she was young at the time, this was clearly the way that the women in her life had cared for her and had taught her to support other people who needed it. And so it's also this generational history, you know, learning from your grandmother, learning from your mother, passing it down, you don't have to be a mother to be an activist mother 

Deb Freeman (12:48):

Cleo Silvers is the other woman that Suzanne shines a light on in her book. Cleo was a Philadelphia native that moved to New York city in the 1960s, joining the Black Panthers party in Harlem. And she became one of the few named women leaders of the Black Panthers survival programs. 

Suzanne Cope (13:08):

Well, first of all, Black Panther Party, I didn't realize how many women were involved. There were so many women and they were leaders, the depth and breadth of the work that they did in the communities they were helping was unbelievable. It blew my mind. Why did people want to stop them from doing this work? It was so effective. And it was serving communities that were unserved and they were doing it through mutual aid and they were doing it just by working incredibly long days. And it was just unbelievable to me that in this short amount of time, how much they got done. And I thought, wow, if they had been given more time or resources, or maybe just not been undermined and worse continually, how much more could they have accomplished? And that's a real refrain that just sticks with me as like, what if, what if 

Deb Freeman (13:54):

A lifelong advocate for public health and social equality, Cleo was instrumental in running the black Panthers, famous Free Breakfast for Children Program 

Suzanne Cope (14:04):

At their height. The free breakfast for children programs were serving in all the chapters around the country. They were serving more children breakfast than the state of California was serving on a daily basis. And they were doing it all with mutual aid at different points during the week, they would go out and, and have their different routes where they would talk to local bodega owners, local grocery store owners, and ask them for donations. 

And most people were very willing because they, they said, “Hey, listen, these, this is a community that supports you and now you need to support them”. Some of them, as some Panthers have told me needed a little more convincing, nothing nefarious, but just sometimes they would boycott and say, “Hey, they're not supporting this program. Are you gonna support them? I suggest you go to the bodega down the street.” And that worked. 

Suzanne Cope (14:50):

They often came around rather quickly and understood that they had to be a member of this community, an active member. So they would gather these donations. Sometimes it was monetary too, to run out and buy the things they needed. They would wake up early every school day, get to community centers and church kitchens. And they would start cooking before dawn and they would be frying up bacon. They'd be making grits, they'd be making eggs. They wanted to make enough so that everybody could have second, thirds, as much food as they wanted. Cleo was telling me a story. She had children that were living in her building. And so they would meet her downstairs and she'd walk with them to the community center. And so they would feed them these hot breakfasts, and then they would do political education. 

They would teach them about the history of Black and Brown people that was not taught in schools and really empowering these children, teaching them their history. They would help them with homework. They would teach them how to sit politely at a table, how to use the spoon and fork. And then they would ask them to clean up and then they would walk them to school. So, first of all, you had much better attendance. So many more students were making it. They were doing better in school because they were well fed. So there were so many benefits to having these breakfast programs and the community saw it right away. They understood it. 

Suzanne Cope (16:06):

But another thing that Cleo and others told me about is that they had such an insight into what was happening in the community during this time. The kids would tell them, “oh, you know, my little brother's sick.” And they eventually might link that to lead poisoning, or they might find out who was struggling with addiction. And that was another thing that the Black Panthers did a lot of work around was community healthcare and, and addiction services. A

nd so they had this great insight and they had this connection to what the community needed. And that was such a theme from the very beginning of my research. And one of the first people I spoke with was Curtis Hayes, Muhammad, who sadly just passed at the beginning of February. He told me, he said, what he learned from Ella Baker, who was a leader in the NAACP. 

Suzanne Cope (16:48):

And she was a leader of SNCC. What she taught them was you go to the people and you do not go in and, and think, you know how to help them. You ask them humbly, how can I help you? And then you listen. And that was something he told me and Cleo told me the same thing. Almost everyone I spoke to told me the same story, that this is how you truly approach community organizing. This is how you help people. And so that really struck me and the breakfast program was born out of that impetus of saying, how can I help the community? 

Deb Freeman (17:21):

Sometimes it's easy to forget what difference the access to something as simple as breakfast can make. Although the program was heavily attacked by federal authorities while it was in existence, it ultimately led to the US government implementing a national breakfast program of its own. Let's fast forward it from freedom summer to the summer of 2020. 

Following the murder of George Floyd, the country was once again, embroiled in a fight for the rights of black people to just exist. In the midst of all the unrest, a coalition of bakers led by Paola Velez banded together to create Bakers Against Racism, which revived the tradition of using food to support and sustain the fight for civil rights. One of the bakers that answered the call is Arley Bell. 

Arley Bell (18:13):

My name is Arley Bell, and I am a baker based in Richmond, Virginia 

Deb Freeman (18:20):

Arley is a talented baker who currently runs a cottage bakery called Arley Cakes in Richmond, Virginia. I called up with Arley and asked her to share how she got started baking. 

Arley Bell (18:32):

I first started baking in college. I wish I had like a cuter origin story. Like I feel like so many people are like, oh, my grandma taught me to bake. And you know, I was like hanging at her apron and she taught me everything. I know, but I just like really started baking in college. I've always been like a sort of artistically inclined person. I love to create things. And I felt like after college baking became the creative outlet for me. I was working at a nonprofit where there wasn't really a budget for birthday cakes and people would just get like a cake from Food Lion. And I'm like, I like my coworkers and I feel like they deserve better birthday cakes. So that was when I really, really started getting into baking, was making birthday cakes for them. And it just kind of like took off from there. 

Deb Freeman (19:25):

Arley makes beautiful cakes and pastries, and she's best known for decorating messages like Black Lives Matter and stop AAPI hate into her creations, scroll through her Instagram. You'll find cakes that look just as provocative as they are delicious. For Arley being political is just an innate part of who she is. And that feeling came into focus in 2016. 

Arley Bell (19:50):

And like I mentioned, my background has been in nonprofit work. And when I made the transition to do baking, I still viewed baking as a way to make change in my community. It was the inauguration after the 2016 election. So it was 2017. But when Trump was inaugurated and Obama was leaving office, I had said something on my Instagram about just being sad about the Obama's leaving office. This was like a really beautiful thing that happened in our history and this era's kind of passing and mourning the end of that. 

And people got really upset with me and they were like, I'm here for cupcakes. Why are you politicizing things? Which was kind of bizarre to me because anybody that knew me in real life, not even people who knew me, like very well knew, like these are the things that I'm about, uh, like issues of social justice are driving the decisions that I make in life. 

Arley Bell (20:52):

And they've always been at the forefront of what's important to me. So I was kind of like surprised, like what, like, how are people like this mad at me? I'm like, this is who I am. And then on inauguration day, I posted a picture from the Women's March in Charlottesville, holding a poster at the March. And I lost like hundreds of followers that day and gained back more than that. 

But it was again, why are people so mad to see me as a Black woman talking about these things? Why is there so much anger towards me talking about this? And I didn't understand that. And in talking to a friend about it, who was like, well, maybe from the jump you need to be like, this is who I am. This is what I'm about. So that no one has questions about why you're here. 

Deb Freeman (21:43):

To be honest, I think it's such a cop out to ask someone, especially a person of color, not to be political. You might as well tell us to stop existing at all. 

Arley Bell (21:55):

So that was a little bit of a turning point for me. And then early summer, such late spring was when the Nazi rallies started to happen in Charlottesville. And the tension around the statues came to a big head- the Confederate statues. So that was a time when a lot of people were mobilizing and having conversations. And I got to get in touch with different people doing different work around Charlottesville while I was also moving to Richmond. So yeah, that was like a weird time to be leaving Charlottesville and still feeling very invested in what was going on there. 

But yeah, I think it was actually for a group organizing around some counter protests with the August 12th rally. I think that was the first time that I put Black Lives Matter on a cake. I feel like that was like a, oh, like, I can put whatever I want on a cake. So I'm gonna put Black Lives Matter. And I also started that summer to put names of people who had been killed by police brutality on cakes. Yeah. So that was my transition. 

Deb Freeman (23:02):

It was hard for a young professional, like Arley to put so much of her personal beliefs front and center, but seeing people take to the streets and seeing her baking peers band together under bakers against racism that offered her some reassurance 

Arley Bell (23:17):

That was summer of 2020. And I had been pretty explicitly tying issues of social justice and race into my baking since 2017. So it was a relief. <laugh> that like, okay, this is a little more normal to people. And people are like joining around this cuz you know, it is therapeutic for me to intertwine baking in these things. It also is exhausting just like being a Black person in America. So to have like so many different people be like, oh yeah, like this is something that I need to talk about and that I need to act on. And I can't just be like passive and silent after years of Black people saying that it was definitely an exciting moment and a bit of a relief too 

Deb Freeman (24:11):

Fighting for quality is about more than reminding folks that Black Lives Matter. It's also about celebrating our wins. Recently, Arley designed a beautiful cake to commemorate the confirmation of judge Ketanji Brown Jackson onto the Supreme court. The cake is white with beautiful purple flowers with a famous Maya Angelo quote that Senator Cory Booker used, “but still like dust, I'll rise.” 

Arley Bell (24:37):

Yeah. It's very, very amazing that Ketanji Brown Jackson was nominated to the Supreme court. And I knew that I wanted to honor it and speak to it in some way through cake. And Cory Booker had quoted my Angelou when he was like, quote unquote, questioning her <laugh> but not really. He was just like so excited, like the rest of us did. 

So I just thought that her poem “still like dust, I’ll rise.” I just thought that it, it speak perfectly to the process that we watch her go through in the last like month, but also just the journey of Black people in America and Black women in America. I just really wanted to share that on a cake. And sometimes <laugh>, 

I feel like when I say Black Lives Matter, sometimes I think that it can just be interpreted as like Black death matters and it's not. Like Black lives mattering isn't only about like grief and injustice. It's also about joy and these amazing accomplishments. So yeah, it was important for me to take some time to celebrate a win. 

Deb Freeman (25:57):

That is something I really relate to. We all know about the tragedies and the injustices and it's important to know those things and hopefully we can grow and somehow get to a place of equality, but it's just as important to talk about the victories and the joy. There's so much for us as Black people to be proud of. We've accomplished so much, not because of, but in spite of, and that deserves to be talked about, it's inspiring to see the younger generation of bakers, like Arley, who are thinking about how they can carry on the legacy of the Aylene Quins and Cleo Silvers while also figuring out their own path. 

Arley Bell (26:37):

I don't know if I call myself an activist that feels like a big title <laugh> to give myself. But sometimes I do think about how do I balance just like taking care of myself and supporting myself. I mean, I'm baking as a business to make money and to be able to pay my bills. And also outside of a grind of capitalism, I want to find joy and beauty in my life and not just be about sadness all the time and giving of myself all the time. I guess that is something that I'm still figuring out. I just hope that Black women are supported. I kind of feel like Black women have been doing a lot <laugh> and for the future <laugh> I would love for them to get a little bit of a break. 

Deb Freeman (27:32):

Black women do deserve a break. Just existing in this world can sometimes feel exhausting. I mean, Malcolm X once said that the most disrespected, unprotected and neglected woman in America is the Black woman. And I'm not sure that still isn't true. 

But even if that is still true, we continue to make a way even when there is no way, often without any credit. But like I said before, we need to make sure to celebrate our wins both big and small because we deserve it. 

This has been setting the table. I'd like to thank my guests, Suzanne Cope and Arley Bell. Follow Suzanne on Instagram @suzannecope_phd and find her book, Power Hungry: Women of the Black Panther Party And Freedom Summer And Their Fight To Feed A Movement at book sellers everywhere. You can check out Arley's beautiful cake designs on her Instagram @arleycakes. And if you're lucky enough to be in the Richmond area, you can order a cake from Arley on her website, arleycakes.com

Deb Freeman (28:32):

Setting The Table is part of Whetstone radio collective. Thank you to the Setting The table team: Producer, Marvin. Yeuh; Audio Editor, Evan Lindsay; Researcher. Haven Ogbaselase; and Intern. Kai Stone. I'd also like to thank Whetstone founder, Steven Satterfield, Whetstone Radio Collective Head of Podcasts, Celine Glasier; Sound Engineer, Max Kotelchuck; Associate Producer, Quentin Lebeau; Production Assistant Amalissa Uytingco, and Sound Intern, Simon Lavender. Cover Art created by Whetstone Art Director, Alexandra Bowman. 

Our theme music is “Who's Back in Town” by Sammy Miller and the congregation. You can learn more about this podcast at whetstoneradio.com on Instagram and Twitter @whetstoneradio and subscribe to our YouTube channel Whetstone Radio Collective for more podcast, video content, you can learn more about all things happening at Whetstone at whetstonemagazine.com.

Until next time I'm Deb Freeman.